Forums › Rave › Free Parties & Teknivals › Houghton Woods Rave
Hi,
Thanks to everyone who has replied to me. I have to admit to being pleasantly suprised by the reception I have been given here. Although I can’t agree with breaking into someones property and having a party, whether you replace the padlock or not, I understand a little more about what are are trying to achieve. I appreciate that you are all about tolerance and having a bit of fun, but you need to understand that we don’t all think that way. As far as I am concerned you lot drove a bloody great sound system into some woods that are not yours, made a load of mess and kept everyone up for 2 nights straight. I understand that you didn’t mean to, but that’s beside the point.
If anyone does know the ‘crew’ that set this up please pass on that the site wasn’t any good. As you might know it’s on top of a large hill which pushed the sound right out over a huge area. Add to that the drugs issue, which as someone said isn’t the point, but does go hand in hand, and you can see why you get a hostile reception in places like this.
I think this will be my last post here, I’ve made my point and you have all been polite enough to listen, thanks.
WM.
Woodsman.
I live in west London, have done all my life.
I first saw the countryside through raving and fell in love with it. Until I followed a sound system into places we wern’t supposed to go, I’d never managed to find proper countryside, it was always fenced off and private. Raving has given me a love for the countryside and shown me that it is open to me, as long as I don’t take the piss.
Clearly this crew didn’t tidy up properly, but that seems about their only crime.
Of course they damaged the locks, they had no choice, why is a wood locked up anyways? It’s not like a bicycle, no one’s gunna nick it if you leave it unlocked.
Yeah the rave makes noise and it disturbs sleep for a few people, whilst providing entertainment for many. This attitude may seem one sided, but remember I live on the final approach to Heathrow, so I have to suffer being woken at 5am every single day of the year, just so the many can enjoy air travel. In this context, is one night’s disturbed sleep really that bad? Yeah I know I could move somewhere elese, if you give me the money to live in a better part of town, I’ll be off, but for now I have to go where the council tell me.
Someone had to go and spoil it. There I was happily thinking that maybe you guys were not as bad as everyone makes out, and that keeping up several hundred people for 2 days straight was an accident that you had taken reasonable precautions to avoid, but this is just the kind of attitude I dislike.
In city bwoys post he says that “Of course they damaged the locks, they had no choice, why is a wood locked up anyways? It’s not like a bicycle, no one’s gunna nick it if you leave it unlocked“. This shows that there needs to be more understanding on your part. A wood like this one needs to be kept locked – its not just a load of trees standing there growing and nobody looking after them. That wood if part timber production, a very valuable rural industry, and part pheasant rearing land. If the place is left open not only do you risk fire damage from illegal camping and raves, but wood theft, poaching, scrambler bikes and littering. The important thing to remember here is that those woods are private. They belong to someone else. You are not supposed to be in there. That’s why there are signs up, and a big steel gate with a padlock on it. There is no question that you had no right to be there – otherwise someone would have given you the key.
His second point, about it providing entertainment for many is again flawed. How many people were there up there? 500? 1000? Either way, I would say that you annoyed many times more people than were there, and as someone said earlier you should not seek enjoyment at the expense of others. In this case, many others. It could be heard 8 miles away. 8 MILES. That is just not on.
I suggest you listen to your more sensible friends like USE, who was polite enough to reply to me even though I was rude to him. Perhaps what I should be saying is that if free parties must go on then I would rather people like you, with no understanding of how the countryside lives and works, stayed at home, while more understanding people enjoyed themselves while taking all the precautions they are able to.
WM
Sorry city bwoy, but I have to agree with most of what woodsman has just said. The site was poorly chosen. In the future Woodsman, would you be willing to meet with those planning events in your local area? Working together to pick a good location would benefit both sides. We get less hassle and you can help to ensure that you are disturbed less as well as less damage being done to sensitive areas.
Obviously this would involve those who organise parties nearby to actually talk to you, hmm…. I’m getting ideas here…. (duck everyone)
USE etc who’ve been doing this longer than me, do you know of any situations like this in the past, where there has been an active effort on the part of those organising parties to meet with people in the area beforehand?
Hi,
It’s not something that I have thought about, and it could be a little complicated for me to do that, though I’m not dismissing it out of hand. I have a connection with Sussex Police, which could become embarassing for us both if something were to go wrong – before you worry I am not a Police Officer, nor do they pay my wages. I can explain more, but at the moment I am enjoying my anonymity on this board. If the connection with the police makes you uneasy and you want to withdraw that offer then I understand, but at the same time if I do decide that I can be of any use to you I won’t be mentioning it to them either.
That said I can’t see any harm in there being some communication between locals and party organisers if it means that you all get to do what you want and it causes less problems in the area. I have to admit to not really understanding the rave scene, but I do know the area very well as I have lived there for over 20 years. As you know I’m not convinced this sort of thing belongs in the countryside, but I’m happy to discuss it with you in a civil manner (no need to duck!) to see if there is any way I can be of help to the locals and you.
I’ll have a think about whether this would put me in an untenable situation, and if it’s something you do want to go ahead with post here. I’ll check it daily for the next week, and if I dont hear anything I’ll assume we’ve agreed to disagree.
WM.
quite often people come to an agreement with a land owner / manager about having a party… so it certainly isn’t out of the question
but some people are unwilling to do this for a few reasons:
but whatever… people should do the best they can to know what is going on around them and plan for potential problems
there are quite a few topics already about good ways to have a positive party
http://www.partyvibe.com/vbulletin/showthread.php?t=1445
http://www.partyvibe.com/vbulletin/showthread.php?t=1253
not everyone holds the same opinions about throwing parties though :crazy_fre …
we just have to try and keep spreading the positive message and i think that this website is definately a useful resource to party-goers, balancing sensible advice with great music, art, photos, gibberish etc
however, i can see how some people who have been involved for a long time have become almost militant… there have been many instances over the years of police brutality and attempts by government to make the simple act of playing music to a group of people illegal
which is baffling to me :question_
until i go to or hear about parties which make us all look bad.. :annoyed:
and by ‘make us look bad’ I don’t just mean other ravers, but society as a whole for isolating (and even outlawing) people’s passtimes
it is well hard to get over the mutual distrust…
i’ve had a few partys on farmers land with their permish, which (with one notable exception, thanks to the local cops) have generally gone smoothy. its great, as most farmers have a shindig of one kind or another at some point, and so either have a spot which is acousticly sheltered that they party, or just know the land really well and so can give the best advice on setting up.
on the other hand, i tried to visit a parish meeting in a patch we hadn’t yet partied, and i literally had to run out of the meeting, as i was scared for my personal safety. it may be patronising, but i think they had just been sucked in by media fabrications. and local gossip. well, they may have had a point, but i kept my cool and they lost theirs, so..
i have also tried liasing with the local police, by just walking into the station to have a chat, and first of they wanted me to make a statement, or recorded conversation, which i was not up for :head_bang then, when i managed to get the head officer come for a stroll, he just said that my main recourse was thru council and parliament, all he could say was that we shouldn’t do it, even tho he could see there was a debate to be had, he had to be a copper and not a human.
my letters to mps either go unanswered or i get an answer to a different question. i have three copies of the tories standard letter that claims they didnt support the war when i have asked them about freeparties. v. confusing. councilors just think “youre a criminal, you dont count” when you chat to them. well, well frustrating.
finally i have also a correspondance with a local reporter from my own area, which helped start a debate in my local press about the issues behind raving. its not like i converted the whole town, but their veiw seems more moderate now, at least in the media.
you can check out press from our area here http://www.nativebeats.co.uk/forums/index.php?act=ST&f=10&t=88&
you will see, we were doin great, until one of our sites was used by some crews from out of the area, they held a multi rigger without inviting us, and that is when a grade one building had its roof burnt off. it should, perhaps be noted that the building had been derelict for over sven years, was totally overgrown inside and out, had no windows and took up a floor space of about 3x3m. not that that excuses or condones the act, which happened when someone climbed onto the roof to juggle fire. if we had been there, we would have had a fire extinguisher, and could have limited the damage.
obviously this event soured th elocals perception of our events, and strengthened the police resolve. it also meant we didnt have a leg to stand on, i cant justify arson, and they never give you time to explain that it wasnt your crew, and they dont care either.
WOODSMAN:
id be up for meeting for a pint at some point, i’m sure we can have a reasonable discussion, and hopefully find some other common interests to chat about! would be good to get a better picture of who you are and what you;’re about, and maybe an explanation of your contact with police- i mean i have coppers who are freind of the family…
ps i have spoken to [i[one[/i] of the soundsystem owners..they left earlier than some, and say they litter picked their patch and didn’t break the fence, but they are going back up to the site in the week to see what the score is and give it a spruce. it seems that the site has been partied a few times a year for some time, and as it was mayday, too many rigs showed up and thus the party over stretched the site.
WM.
thanks for your comments and consideration, Woodsman
I admire your courage… going to see what the source of your problem was, both on the night and by commenting here, as well as offering to facilitate a channel of communication in your area
integrity clearly on display :bigsmile:
I’m a little bit concerned though, about a couple of things:
on the flip side
I can’t speak for anyone else, but I think perhaps Woodsman could best serve by supporting a committee of a free, legal event, perhaps even helping to develop of one, with other people / groups in the area?
that would be a good way to help provide a (well planned and less disruptive) outlet for peoples’ creative and celebratory spirit in a rural environment :horay:
what say you?
NB: this is just my opinion, obv :bulb:
Woodsman -TBH your connection with Sussex Police doesn’t create much of a threat for this site or raves as a whole – that force regularly visits the rave boards (including ours) in a semi covert fashion anyway to see if they can get info! – but it may put you in danger…
the problem with meetings and the like is the feelings in rural areas are running so high at the moment and views are becoming more entrenched – as others said it could wreck your standing in the community – You clearly come across as a good egg so we also want to protect you… and wouldn’t want this to happen.
these things have been held before.
At one the locals walked out of the meeting when a senior officer let young ravers who were also locals in the area have their say!
As you no doubt know very well the rural lot are feeling put upon; they are suffering competition from the new EU countries for their markets at the very ame time their subsidies are all being changed and often reduced, many would feel this is “giving in to criminals whilst the Government reduce our funding” [although the truth is that a pragmatic approach to using spare land for recreation could potentially replace lost income sources from traditional farming!]
As others have said, lots of people put on these events. One problem occurs when “out of area” crews turn up (perhaps because a party in their area has been closed down) and swell the numbers beyond what is appropriate, and then do not participate in clearing up.
Before we (in the UK) go anywhere near setting up licensed free parties (if this is the aim) we need to ensure we don’t end up with the situation that happened in France where they end up as a a single grudingly licensed chav-fest with added environmental hazards (whilst all other parties get shut down by riot police!)
OTOH I agree with you on a lot of the rural issues, and quite frankly think that unlicensed events in their current format may not be sustainable (there is a real danger of health and safety issues and/or violent crime).
I am originally a city boy and grew up in a rough part of SE London, but my family (who incidentally owned a smallholding in their ancestral country of Malaysia) worked hard so they could afford to move to suburban areas, and I have since spent a lot of time in West Berkshire and Oxfordshire where as a boy I learnt (both at school and at play) to respect the countryside and what goes on there.
I personally appreciate the value of the British timber industry and other local rural industries from an environmental POV – I enjoy tucking in to a (legitimately purchased!) pheasant, (ok the veggies won’t like it but at least it had more freedom than most chickens!) and would far rather that timber came from the UK where organisations like the Forestry Commission ensured it was harvested in a sustainable manner than from Asian rain forests where it is often taken illegally and without the appropriate environmental protection safeguards.
The people who broke into an obviously signposted wood on a hill were clearly in the wrong, however good this party was… I’ve known other crews to reject beautful potential venues because they have seen the signs that these areas are private.
However, a lot of people do not have sufficient knowledge of what goes on in the countryside, although many do look upon the net to research (not just venues but how to try and avoid inappropriate choices of locations) but its not always clear even on OS maps what is public and private land, and where the nearest villages are. It actually helps everyone when people like you to explain some of these things!
i cannot obviously promise that every rave crew who uses this board as a resource will heed any of our advice, but just by taking part in this discussion you have highlighted some important issues.
I hope that whatever happens you manage to engage in some sort of dialogue with party people (even if it is just on this board) – if you register here you can send private messages as well – and maybe even if you find the rave music hard on your ears (and not all of it is as fast and loud as you may think on first hearing!), there are other discussions about the environment and nature you may find of interest…
There was an area of land that was used by a crew that I knew and we joined in a few times. This landowner was happy for us to use it and the villagers didn’t mind too much provided we kept the events to a minimum.
But then lots of parties were held there (not by the usual people) and in the village meeting there was an argument about the disruption. The police didn’t take action so an angry villager did and covered the place in oil. And since then one of the buildings on the site has colapsed (not sure if this was caused by a person or not) and has become dangerous so even after the oil has dispersed this site is now too risky to party.
Shame really. I’m pretty sure there are similar deals and situations like this all over the country. Just hope they don’t get spoilt like this one.
FYI, the site in question wasn’t too far from you Woodsman.
thats worse environmental contamination than raves! whoever did that has committed a serious criminal offence, endangered wildlife, people and their domestic pets, created a general health and safety hazard for the population as a whole and caused damage to that area for the long term.
If someone had done that in my area I would have photographed the evidence and turned it straight in to the Environment Agency…
Hi,
I had a think about this last night, and I agree that there are a couple of points that cause me concern. The first, as USE said, is that it’s hard to get over mutual distrust. I can see why you wouldn’t trust me, and equally you can see why I’d be a little nervous turning up in some woods in the middle of the night with people I don’t know! I suppose the only thing to do, if we do decide to go forward, would be to meet someewhere for a pint where either of us are free to walk away at any time. Sound fair? I know I was rude at first, for which I have apologised, but I hope I have made it clear that I can be civil.
The connection with the Police could be difficult if you were to ask me to help organise an illegal rave, and I don’t think I would be able to help you for the reasons that globalloon picked out below. I would not want to get into trouble for it, and I can see why you would be concerned about giving me information about yourselves, locations etc. However, if you wanted to investigate the possibility of organising a legal event I would be happy to discuss it with someone. I’m not about much over the next couple of days, but I’ll try and check back here over the weekend.
WM
Bollocks did it keep several hundred people up for 2 days straight. If you have a legitimate argument, there’s no need to use hyperbole, but of course you are just pissed off.
Forgive me for being a dumbo from da city, but please explain how the fuck a poxy lock is going to stop a poacher, illegal camping, fire, litter, wood theft, scrambler bikes or raves.
Fuck private woods, the woods are woods, part of our planet, just cos some rich cunt’s claimed them as his doesn’t mean I have to go along with his shite. Besides you stated that these woods are part owned by the Forrestry Commission and that is part owned by me.
You should not seek enjoyment at the expense of others huh? How beautifully pious of you. Try telling that to the millions who live under Heathrow’s flight path. Of the hundreds of thousands who live near Wembley, or Highbury or any other mass entertainment venue.
WM
Hey I just love cuntry folk going on about how city folk have no understanding of how the countryside works. No idea about how it’s carved up between a bunch of aristos who enslave serfs to work the land for the aristos benefit, whilst getting us city folk to shell out billions in subsidies to keep these cunts in clover.
Fuck all that shit. The more I hear cunty folk going on about that kind of shit, the more I’m glad you you lost sleep.
Now fuick off before I stab you with me crak pipe.
calm down city bwoy…
the landowners and law makers do have the power
the better people understand each other, the less potential for conflict
and that’s just better all round IMO
the landowners and law makers do have the power
the better people understand each other, the less potential for conflict
and that’s just better all round IMO
I have a good idea who city bwoy is and why his feelings are running so high – but there’s no need to stir the pot like that. This is not dirtycircus…
but the subsidies argument no longer holds water. The EU realised what was happening (and also more likely didn’t want to pay for the poorer countries who joined last year) and the subsidies are being drastically slashed this year – in true British fashion it has been done in the way that causes maximum pain and disruption to everyone involved.
The farmers will get less, (and it will be the small farmers who bear the brunt as big landowners pass on the burden), and there are now way less people in the govt agencies now to deal with their queries or process their claims…. everyone is suffering now and whatever government gets in there will be pain throughout the countryside – but the best way to make a positive out of this is for people from city and country to work together rather than the generations of bickering and arguing…
the arguments over Wembley or Reading Festival (which I mentioned) are correct, but these organisers have paid for their PELs which is why the disruption is tolerated. It is how the so-called “free market” works.
City Bwoy – Woodsman is trying to offer us an olive branch (he could have just complained to his media like the other do), and you are trying to snap it in half and poke his eye with it – yet he might still also have a rifle….
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Forums › Rave › Free Parties & Teknivals › Houghton Woods Rave
